Better response (low revs / high gears)

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Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby scoppack » Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:02 pm

I have now written 2 maps to my car (EDC16C34)
1st map-
upped DW 80-100% (gradually)
increased TL (from 1500rpm +5Nm, to 2250+ approx. +35Nm)
lowered lambda map slightly in 750/1750 to 900/4500 area (4-10%)

This pulls well as long as its on boost, accelerating from 1st to 5th,
but I'd like better response at lower revs but in higher gears

2nd map -
upped boost from IQ:13, RPM:1500 to IQ:40 RPM:5000, from 3% to 9% gradually
also increased SVBL to accommodate.

Its still struggles at 30mph in 5th gear to pull away.
I had a 306hdi which pulled in every gear at every speed.

What do I need to adjust to get the lower down response in a higher gear?

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby scoppack » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:37 am

I'll get some logs of what I can after work today.
I know I haven't changed anything on the lower range (1500/1750), but on the 306 (EDC15) it was so much more driveable at lower revs and all the information I have read, most don't change anything <1500, so how can it improve pick-up 1000-15000 in higher gears. It is kind of lumpy and struggles if you force it, but if you VERY light-foot it, it will eventually build up.

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby ominimicu » Thu Jul 24, 2014 5:42 pm

CLosing egr helps a lot in low revs...
but basically what u need is exhaust gases to spin the turbo...hard to achive at low rpm

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby scoppack » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:18 pm

So I could actually alter the EGR hysteresis to only operate between a narrower range, but still work?

The original is:
0 750 1000 1250 1500 2000 2250 2500 2750 3000 3100 3200
0 100 1000 1500 1800 2125 2500 2600 2675 2650 2400 1500 1200

And I could change it to:
0 750 1000 1250 1500 2000 2250 2500 2750 3000 3100 3200
0 100 100 100 100 1500 1900 2500 2675 2650 2400 1500 1200

So that its still working, but doesn't steal my gasses for the lowest revs?

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby scoppack » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:09 pm

Also, my first quarter of the lambda
250 350 375 400 425 450 475 500
499 948.679 948.679 948.679 948.679 948.679 948.679 948.679 948.679
500 12.569 16.876 16.582 17.625 17.949 17.552 15.788 15.935
800 12.569 16.876 16.582 17.625 17.949 17.552 15.788 15.935
900 12.804 17.243 16.758 17.625 17.949 17.552 15.788 15.935
1000 16.787 16.920 16.934 16.949 16.949 16.964 15.994 15.994
1250 17.375 15.773 16.008 16.214 16.464 16.332 16.199 16.067
1500 17.905 17.375 16.523 16.964 17.228 16.846 16.714 16.582
1750 19.198 19.272 18.110 18.110 17.949 17.611 17.640 17.478
w/AFR of 14.7, is it worth increasing/lowering it a bit from 350-500 in 1000-15000 while the turbo is spooling?
(I believe to increase allowed I.Q.??)
I need to add a 950 column as its a 1560 engine, and running just short of 2400 for approx. 55. I'm not 100% on the workings of the lambda yet, so any help greatly appreciated.

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby serge4234 » Mon Sep 15, 2014 9:28 am

scoppack wrote:So I could actually alter the EGR hysteresis to only operate between a narrower range, but still work?

The original is:
0 750 1000 1250 1500 2000 2250 2500 2750 3000 3100 3200
0 100 1000 1500 1800 2125 2500 2600 2675 2650 2400 1500 1200

And I could change it to:
0 750 1000 1250 1500 2000 2250 2500 2750 3000 3100 3200
0 100 100 100 100 1500 1900 2500 2675 2650 2400 1500 1200

So that its still working, but doesn't steal my gasses for the lowest revs?

Could you advise - is there any pactical result in restricting EGR at low engine speed 1000 - 1500 rpm? Do you feel any extra torgue before turbo starts?

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby scoppack » Mon Sep 15, 2014 11:15 am

Having tested/read some more, due to some of the exhaust gasses not being recirculated, all expelled exhaust now goes to the turbo, so if anything, you now have too much at the turbo and need to wastegate/vnt more past it. So it should be more responsive due to extra spool, but negated by the back pressure. :(
I want to de-DPF so there is less restriction, but don't want to touch it really until there is a physical problem.
The problem now is that a small change to VNT needs to be mapped then tested and logged, and so on.......
I tried opening (i hope) a little and there seemed no difference, so I opened by a larger amount and got terrible lag and splutters when accelerating, so quickly re-wrote the older map back.
Now getting a little lost with info out there with everything.

Note: The 2 hysteresis maps are
1st map: value to turn off when reached/accelerating (i.e. when IQ 30+ turn off/close)
2nd map: value to turn back on (i.e. when IQ falls back 25< then open again)
Hope this right, and helps someone!

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby juice » Thu Sep 18, 2014 12:32 pm

Better response in lower reves and lower loads
1) Block EGR
2) Open turbo vanes, when block EGR the backpressure remaines between engine and turbo. Opening vanes, helps gases to go out quicker.
3) Lower the boost from 0 to 15 mg of fuel, you dont need boost until this fuel quantity, maybe until 20 mg. More boost doesnt mean more power in LOWER LOADS. More boost means more NEGATIVE work for turbo, and this work can be done only squeezing/blocking exhaust gases. Normal city driving, almost that doesnt need turbo to be present (i dont mean those moments when you racing in city)
4) Optimize Start of injection from 0 to 20 mg , keep it around 2-3 BTDC degrees.
5) Increase driver wish from 50 60%, will not create a bigger fuel consumption, only better transition in full load area.
I have more than 200 tests and logs on the road to create an optimal map and thats what i saw during these tests and learning from pro tuners.

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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby scoppack » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:41 pm

I don't know enough about SOI, I have them in my maps, but there seem to be an initial 2 maps 16x16 that make sense, but then following them after a space, are 16x17,18,19 etc. Its a shame there isn't 1 map, but then offset maps for egr, temp, limp etc.
Also the N75, I lowered the values, to open them, but it was like it was starving them and the car was spluttering. (from 4 to 20 IQ, and 1000-2100rpm)
I've posted some pics.
Would SOI1 look normal running, and SOI2 retarded?
Theres a fantastic lump at 3000rpm! theres a boost map to match.
I presume for a more efficient map, values can just increase from idle, and from 0 IQ. and not dip down as they do in the middle
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Re: Better response (low revs / high gears)

Postby scoppack » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:52 pm

Here's one of the other maps, that I initially thought was SOI
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